The Trinity and the Loss of Identity

Questions and conversation about religious beliefs, Scripture, the Spirit of Prophecy, and Creation 7th Day Adventism
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Pastor Chick
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Location: Kisoro - Uganda

The Trinity and the Loss of Identity

Postby Pastor Chick » August 6th, 2013, 9:35 pm

I just read a link on the Internet by the title I have posted as the topic for this thread.

Find the link here:

I felt the author did a splendid job of making a vital point. What do others say?

David Aguilar
Posts: 63
Joined: May 28th, 2012, 4:28 pm

Re: The Trinity and the Loss of Identity

Postby David Aguilar » August 10th, 2013, 1:27 pm

I like the flow of reasoning here.

There are problems with the argument in favor of the Trinity from the very first principles of the traditional reasoning, and the article touches on them a little. For example, they will say, as quoted at the beginning of the article:

"The God of the Bible is a triune Being because HE IS LOVE. Love cannot be exercised in isolation. You cannot be all-loving and be alone at the same time. Love is manifested in relationships."

There are a list of things wrong with attempting to use this reasoning to "prove" a trinity of beings:

1) While it is true that love cannot be exercised in isolation, the Bible does not say "God expresses love." It says He IS Love. Yahweh is the source and perfect representation of love, and this has nothing to do with the expression of manifestation OF that love. After Yahweh created mankind, then He could express His love to mankind. However, Yahweh - who does not have the limitations of time as we do - loved us from eternity even before we were created, (Rom 4:17) even if we were not yet in existence to recieve that expression of His affections.

2) We know that "The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand." (John 3:35) The Son "came forth" from the Father in "eternity." This is not an easy thing for human beings to grasp, and so we generally do not even try to explain it; however, we believe that the Son is everlasting, and there was no "time" before the Son existed. That being the case, if there is mutual love between the Father and Son from everlasting unto everlasting; there is still no need to extract a "trinity" from Two Beings that love one another (and can express that love to one another) and share a common Spirit. It seems to me that this line of reasoning introduces an EXTRA identity into the equation, while simultaneously reducing the distinction between the two that DO exist.

3) Human pride has always attempted to explain or reduce Yahweh to our limitations. As the quote says, "You cannot be all-loving and be alone at the same time." Even if that were true, without qualification, for "you," (any human being) that does not say anything about the capabilities of our Father. Human reasoning has it that one cannot be humble and at the same time truly aware of the value of one's own humility (or else we would become proud of being humble). Yet under divine inspiration, human beings become precisely this.

4) As I mentioned just in our weekly study last night, for example, while discussing an unrelated issue:
This is a very delicate matter to contemplate [the nature of human "will"], but it is one of the less obvious reasons why CSDAs have generally had issue with the traditional Trinity doctrine. The “possession” by the Holy Spirit, by which the Father and Son come to dwell within us, is not the possession of a sentient spirit/spiritual person like a demon, one that controls the will and causes one to act contrary to his or her desires.
To be Spirit-filled does not mean to become a puppet. As I began the study by saying, conversion makes us our true, individual selves. “I” truly become “I.”

Thus, an acceptance of the traditional viewpoint would provide a loss of identity for the human being as well as the individual members of the Godhead. As the article rightly quotes, "The unity that exists between Christ and His disciples does not destroy the personality of either. They are one in purpose, in mind, in character, but not in person. It is thus that God and Christ are one." [8T 268,269]

Those are my thoughts at this time.

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Re: The Trinity and the Loss of Identity

Postby Barbara » August 10th, 2013, 1:53 pm

Wow, he really goes through a lot of explanation to cover - and then make - his point. He does a good job.

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